[Music]
this move outcome didn't last long makin
peace be with you
welcome back to another episode of the
Dene show and today we're going to have
in the studio dr. Lawrence Brown he's an
amazing individual his stories at the
Dean show calm with several other
episodes that we've done with him he in
short was an atheist someone who didn't
believe in God which is evident I mean
design indicates a designer something
that's logical rational we didn't make
ourselves create ourselves someone
created us and it's the one God from
there he went to being or trying very
hard to be a Christian to being a Muslim
the same way Jesus Abraham Noah they
were all Muslim they submitted
themselves to the one God this is what a
Muslim is but it took something very
very special inside a person that needs
to come out sincerity that's what we're
going to revisit today his story and
we're going to try to find out what was
it what was it that really led him
finally to making that step of sincerity
to accepting look that I don't have
answers to all the questions I'm gonna
take a break from all the baseball in
the football games I'm gonna put the
beer down the Jack and Coke and I'm
gonna stop visiting the nightclubs and
I'm gonna stop just chasing the money
and living from Friday to Friday
paycheck to paycheck and I'm gonna
inquire and really want to find out
what's the purpose of life I don't have
answers to all these questions where am
I going when I die and what have had him
take the extra leap to step forward and
accept the way of life that brings you
peace happiness contentment in this life
in Paradise in the next we'll be back
with dr. Lawrence Brown don't go nowhere
this is the most of the world already
knows they've seen him on the Dean show
before he's here with me take a good
look he's back in the Dean show studio
dr. Lawrence Brown Salaam alaikum
well it's Assam peace be with you my
brother dr. Allen - so alright people
already know who you are they've been
watching the Dean show you have your own
private section we've done so many other
shows before and you know the first show
that we did was about your conversion
story and people really enjoyed it we
got so many emails so much positive
feedback and we want to continue on
because there was some questions that
arose from this program and people were
digging they wanted to really know you
know more of the insights what actually
had you take that that extra step
because many people you know everything
when is explained to them the tenants of
faith the oneness of God they a judgment
accountability original goodness not
original sin everything in slum makes
sense it brings you you know peace
happiness but sometimes all this
evidence you know people see it but they
don't accept it because they have other
things on in mind maybe they're not
sincere with themselves and their
Creator but it seems like you were you
hear what happened talk to us well I
think it's a good question and I think
basically what your what you're saying
is what made me take the step okay we
all know what put me on the religious
search anybody has seen my conversion
story knows that I was on a religious
search but how did that end in Islam and
actually I trace it all back to the
prayer that I prayed when when my
daughter was in the intensive care unit
you know in brief just to kind of recap
anybody who wants to look back on my
conversion story it all started when my
daughter was born with a lethal
defect in the aorta the major vessel
that comes off of the heart and that led
me to pray a prayer and I remember to
this day that what I prayed was I was
atheist at the time so I didn't even
know if God was there so I prayed sort
of a typical prayer for an atheist so Oh
God if you are there I said I don't know
if you're there or not but if you are
there I need help
and I remember that in that prayer I
promised God that if he would save my
daughter and then guide me to the
religion that was most pleasing to him
that I would follow and I think that to
me is the key because you know after he
saved after after our Creator saved my
daughter I realized I had made a promise
that put me upon my religious search
you've introduced me many times by
saying that I was trying hard to become
a Christian why was I trying to so hard
to become a Christian because I was
trying to fulfill my promise to God I
promised that if he guided me that I
would follow and growing up in America I
just naturally assumed I would find the
answer somewhere in Christianity and I
kept going from congregation to
congregation to congregation
I know I've described to you I don't
know if I've described to the viewers I
mean I attended Mormon seventh-day
Adventist Greek Orthodox Roman Catholic
you know my head kind of Southern
Baptist my head kind of swims with the
you know the different congregations I
went to looking for the truth and I
always went through the same scenario
where I would you know I would ask the
the priests or the ministers or the
pastors I would ask them questions that
in the end they would never answer I
would say well you say Jesus Christ was
the son of God and Jesus Christ called
himself the son of man he called himself
the Son of Man why do you call him the
Son of God and we would get into it I'd
say okay you believe in the Trinity
which is nowhere in the Bible and the
you used to hold up the Trinity was
written by a scribe but it's not in the
scripture etc etc etc and we would get
into it you know going through all the
different doctrines of Christianity in
the same way that we have addressed them
in other episodes of the Deen show and I
never got any satisfying answers which
pushed me on you know that's that's when
I would say well thank you you know
thanks anyway I'd move on and it wasn't
until I learned about Islam that all of
the pieces fit in place Islam is the
only religion that answered all of my
questions it was only when I learned
about Islam that that my heart and my
mind opened to Islam as the religion of
truth but the key to that is this the
key to that is I used to think I was
really intelligent I used to think wow I
cracked the code I figured out where
other people haven't you know I mean but
I I would I would you know I would
attribute it to myself you know some
years later I had a I had a patient a
woman who called me telling me she
wanted to become Muslim I don't know why
and she was panicking when she called me
a couple days later she came into my
clinic with a newborn baby who was full
of tubes oxygen in his nose hep-lock
feeding tube a variety I mean this baby
this baby was you know in very bad
condition but barely doing well enough
to have at least been discharged from
the hospital and I realized that this
was the woman who had called me a couple
days before saying she wanted to become
Muslim she knew I was Muslim and and I
was known in that area and she had
called me but when she came in I you
know I examined her baby and the story
came out the story came out that her
baby was born with what was considered
by the doctors to be a near-lethal heart
defect and she called me when she was
panicking thinking her her son was going
to die
and then her son got better and he
stabilized and they discharged him from
the hospital with all these tubes but
discharged from the hospital and I asked
her I said well you know works you the
one who called me wanting to become
Muslim and she said yes and I said so do
you still want to and she said no no I
don't need it now I don't need it now
she said she said I don't need it now
see he's gotten better
my son's gotten better so I don't need
it now oh you want it okay okay now I
look back on this situation and I I
think okay you know she had a child that
was on death's door I had a child on
death's door she prayed to God for God
to save that child I prayed to God to
save my child we both made promises to
God okay why did God put me up on the
path of the religion of truth and keep
me on that path and why did God not put
her on the same path can it be sincerity
now my yeah I mean my point is it comes
down to sincerity sure that's a big part
of it but the main thing is that we just
have to recognize that God guides who He
wills and he leaves to stray who He
wills
it's not about intellect it's not about
intellect
it's about inspiration it's about
illumination and if we start to think
that we are the ones that we are the
ones responsible for putting ourselves
on this path that we figured it out with
our intellect then we are giving credit
in the wrong direction
because the credit really is to God to
God thank God for having guided us
having made us Muslim put us on this
path and kept us on this path because he
could just as easily have given this to
the other person yeah and taking it from
us yes and when we say God notice we're
talking about the god of Jesus Abraham
Noah the God who created geez the guy
who jesus prayed to that's God could you
see people say God and say oh thank you
Jesus or you know they'll I don't praise
the creation of God when we say God
we're talking about the one God put it
in terms that everybody can understand
we're talking about the Creator the
creator of the universe and everything
in it simple so the one true God one
true God let's take a break we'll be
right back there's more of this
historia dr. Lawrence Brown Allah open
hamdulillah
but now Eli ha in na na na boo egg bum
I love egg bone soup Adam la open
hamdulillah I'm gonna heal aha in na na
na egg bomb
I love egg bomb I don't lie open
hamdulillah I'm gonna ilaha il'allah
w'allahu akbar i love egg bomb
subhanAllah open hamdulillah I'm gonna
ilaha il'allah w'allahu akbar allah
akbar allah al hamdulillah I'm gonna
ilaha il'allah w'allahu akbar allah
akbar subhan allah and hamdulillah I'm
gonna allow her in love love
[Music]
back here on the Dean show with dr.
Lawrence Brown PhD of religious studies
DD Doctor of Divinity and you are a
doctor by profession yeah you some
consider you a Krishna scholar and we've
done many shows with you in the past but
the one that really took off was your
conversion story we'll continue on we
want to people want to know more details
about this I want to take it back for a
minute now I remember in your story when
we first met you said that if you wanted
money as an atheist now you were self
independent you felt like okay if I
wanted money I worked harder you said if
you wanted this you got that if you
wanted that you got that you know you
whatever it was material you fixed it if
something was broke you fixed it but
this is a key point that now many
atheists we know that this is a small
minority but you were one of them and
that at that moment when your your your
child your baby was sick almost at the
verge of death it was out of your hands
mm-hmm can you comment on this was this
a turning point you said that you felt
like you couldn't do it you were
helpless well it's exactly as you said
you know before before Islam before
religion if I ever needed anything I
worked for it and that was the first
time in my life that I felt helpless and
I needed help and that's why I turned to
God there's this old saying that there
are no atheists in a foxhole you know
there are no atheists on a battlefield
well you know the artillery shells are
coming down and the bullets are whizzing
by I guarantee you everybody gets
religion but you also made a point just
and add to this that many of us have
become dependent healthcare Medicare you
know yeah you remember how I was talking
about this woman saying I don't need it
now yeah I don't need God now the child
has gotten better yeah
okay it's kind of a common feeling among
people that their lives are taken care
of yes I'm the cradle to the grave I
mean you've got health insurance you've
car insurance you've got house insurance
without disability and
if you fall and break a leg in the store
you're going to sue the store and their
insurance will cover them and that will
pay you and on and on and on and so we
live in a society where people feel that
their insurance is with man-made
institutions which will cover them for
almost any eventualities but it's when
you face the eventualities that can't be
insured you know you can have health
insurance to pay for your illness but do
you really want to be ill in the first
place okay you can have life insurance
that will pay somebody after you die but
that's not going to help you once you're
dead so you know you come to critical
points where where you realize that you
need God isn't it far better to
recognize that we need God in in all
things and all things in all things know
you you can you can trust your human
construct of insurance or you can trust
the Creator it's your choice but this is
the difference between those who put
their trust in the worldly you know
institutions and those those who put
their trust in the divine now let's move
it back moving forward now we were tell
my sincerity you know people they have
it in themselves to be sincere somebody
really sincerely wants some drugs you
know they'll go out there and the hustle
and bustle to get those drugs and nobody
since serum party you know they'll cry
for it the the girl who wants something
from her parents you know young lady
older lady you know she won't get her
way with her husband or her boyfriend
whatever the case and she'll sincerely
shed tears to get what she wants same
thing with the man who wants to get it
let's say the nightclub here sincerely
sweat the doorman give him some money to
get into the club but how about that
sincerity of wanting guidance wanting to
know the purpose of life and who best to
tell us than the one who created life
how does a person get that sincerity
yeah well you know one thing I think I
would say is I don't completely agree
with what you just said about sincerity
people do a lot of things to get what
they want
but afterwards when they look themselves
in their mirror and they're in their
minds I you know not necessarily looking
in the mirror in the literal sense but
when they realized that they just did
something you know pretty immoral or
pretty lowdown or pretty dishonest or
whatever to get what they want they'll
justify it I mean they'll say I really
needed it I really wanted it but at the
same time they'll have a little bit of a
low opinion of themselves you know man
did I really have to get it that way you
know did I really have to lie did I
really have to cheat that I really after
Steele did I really have to be immoral
did I really have to this that day the
other thing you know a lot of a lot of
times people compromise their values to
get what they want but you can't do that
with God because God knows what's in
your heart and he knows if you're being
sincere or not you can't play these
games with the crater yeah you can't I
mean you can't play these games I mean I
remember once talking to a Christian and
I said do you really believe do you
really believe in your religion he said
no he said I don't believe it any part
of it
but I have been baptized so when I die
you know I'll have that to fall back on
you know as if somehow that's going to
save him he doesn't believe anything he
doesn't follow anything he's not leading
a righteous life but he believes that
simply because he was baptized well he
can fall back on that as if that's going
to save him yes so you know we we know
from the Bible faith without works is
dead faith and works is the formula okay
but in addition to faith in addition to
works you have to have sincerity
yes sincerity now you mentioned a story
we we know your story and you made a
promise to the crater you know he showed
you his sign and we know that okay every
individual they might have some personal
things experiences that happened to them
but we have the ultimate proof the
verbatim Word of God which is a living
miracle science history prophecies
everything's in there facts not fiction
that a person can really take it
analytical a scientific approach to come
to
the conclusion is 1.5 billion people
have come to that there's no way that
this car an could come from other than
the creator of heavens and earth but now
tell us you were sincere and you
followed up what you stated to the
crater was in your heart you followed up
with action this lady she got her prayer
answered God saved her child then she
backed away isn't there something in the
verbatim Word of God you comment on his
what god almighty is saying that look
when they call upon him alone
they dropped his son in the Holy Ghost
so they don't go to Krishna or this calf
God or the baby God you know they go to
the one God and he answers them and then
they go back to worshiping other gods
besides God sure and and they go back to
their ways yeah yeah yeah it's it's I
mean this is well known and there's one
the the story that leaps to my mind is
the story in the in the Holy Quran which
describes the sailors in the ship on the
sea that is getting tossed around in a
storm they think they're going to drown
they all profess true faith but then
when they reach the land they go back
and interestingly enough interestingly
enough I know a real life story like
this tell us this tell us this please I
met a brother a Muslim working in the
Merchant Marine okay he's working in the
Merchant Marine on this ocean-going
vessel there was something like 20-some
people who they were just constantly
making fun of him you know him stopping
in his day to make his daily prayers and
his dietary restrictions didn't join in
with them with the with the drinking and
this that or the other thing constantly
making fun of him making his life
miserable until they got in just this
horrendous storm and the ship became
crippled and everybody believed it was
going to go down and that they were
gonna drown and literally every single
person on that ship came to that Muslim
brother and made Shahada and he I mean
he testified he said every single person
on that ship came and testified and
became Muslim now when you say this tan
yeah
and when they were saved and when this
ship just kind of limped into port and
everybody got off at the ship every
single one of them went back Wow
so at the heat No so I mean it's just
fulfillment of the Quranic story yeah
how some some people you know when the
pressure is the upon them it oh god save
me god save god zip what I'm saved
oh thanks you know and they just you
know they just go back to what they were
upon before when you're in the air and
the turbulence they may not even say
thanks yeah may just be oh well it was
just a storm it was just I would have
been saved anyway you know this sort of
thing so yeah so when a turbulent hits
when the waves are high shaking in the
boat and you feel your life's brought to
end you turn to God yeah but this goes
back to you not being sincere then and
then you know I face this myself yeah I
mean when when my daughter reversed when
my daughter reversed without medicine
without surgery with no treatment and
became a perfectly normal child the
doctors had an explanation okay
and that's suffice for them he didn't
suffice for me because I knew the prayer
that I had prayed and I I knew with the
certainty that this was the hand of God
in the healing of my child but that was
what was in my heart where did I get
that feeling from from myself no I
that's from God mm-hmm you know there's
a famous famous story of a scholar who
is travelling and in his travels he he
he went to sleep and when he woke up
there's a cloud and this cloud had a
light and the light spoke to him and
told him that because of his great
scholarship because of his great piety
he God was releasing this man from the
obligation of prayer mm-hmm and this
scholar didn't even need to think about
it he just said to the cloud said Oh
curse it Shaitaan you are trying to
mislead me you are trying to misguide me
you know because God did not even
release the profits from prayer and who
is more righteous than them
ya see so when he acknowledged the the
cloud as what it really was a trick of a
trick of the Satan trying to misguide
him the clouds the cloud acknowledged
that it was the Satan said yes you are
right this is a Satan know that only
your intelligence has saved you
What did he say that Oh curse it's a
time Shaitaan Oh curse it Satan it is
not my intelligence that has saved me
you know the only thing that saves me is
a God now how many of us would have said
what I said yeah yeah you're right man I
figured it out I figured out that you're
the Satan so yeah it's it's my
intelligence that saved me no the Satan
doesn't give up he tries to get you to
disbelieve and if you can't get you to
disbelieve he will try to get to trip
you up in other words yeah so you know
when he couldn't get him disbelief you
tried to get him to believing that it
was his intelligence but being a true
scholar you know he said no it's only
God that is saving me yeaseong and what
did the satan say he said he said that
he cannot touch him but that he had
misguided seventy scholars by this way
before him Wow scholars not lady
scholars it's a big lesson to us no
matter how high you get in the chain of
religious knowledge you can still become
misguided and we got to be careful be
right back with more here on the D show
why is our news media foaming at the
mouth when it comes to stories about
Islamic terrorists but not white guy
terrorists is that because Muslims are a
bigger threat in fact between 1980 and
2005 94 percent of all the attempted or
successful terrorist attacks on US soil
were not carried out by Islamic radicals
but instead by non-muslims mostly white
guys so then why the obsession
it's killing of innocent human beings
human life is precious you will not feel
a woman do not kill a child do not you
know going to different deliciously it
is an individual forms of Christianity I
even ran into people from the nation of
a sloth feeling a man you will not feel
an animal you will not cut a tree down
do not turn under water do not burn
their homes
[Music]
it's a way of life brought to us bad the
messenger bestop me show us the way to
Alyce Grizz this is the D D now this man
this is the D do you nervous back here
on the Dean show with dr. Lawrence Brown
continuing on yes not only do we have to
be careful we have to be extra extra
careful because the devil Shaitaan is
always working to mislead us this is
something as detrimental to our success
nodding on this light but definitely the
next tell us now in the last few minutes
that we have and you know we know that
faith goes up and down sometimes we're a
little 10 sometimes on level 5 and also
you know some people they do sincerely
you know they pray to God and then God
delivers the guidance to help but now
distraction did you ever get distracted
you know men with the women women with
the men money so what advice do you have
for these situations that occurred
distractions and the level of faith
going down and then you go back and
revert to old ways old bad habits did I
ever get distracted no I've been perfect
from day one no nothing
of course I'm being extremely sarcastic
no it's it's as you said all of us our
faith waxes and wanes at different
levels and I think you just have to
constantly remind yourself who is the
source of all things in this life you
have to constantly return to this to the
Shahadah the Shahada being the testimony
of faith you know the Shahada is very
simple we are testifying to the belief
in God as one God the only one worthy of
worship is Allah our Creator and that
Muhammad peace be upon him was his final
prophet
and when when your when your belief you
know sort of becomes weakened when
things come at you to fill you with
doubt in my experience all you have to
do is go back to the Shahada and just
say to myself wait a minute these things
might be knocking me down a little bit
but the Shahada God is one God Muhammad
is the Prophet yeah you know what I
still believe that and that's what I'm
gonna hold on to and as soon as you know
every time you restate the Shahada even
if you say it out loud but just to
yourself it just it raises your amen
it raises your you know level of belief
and so I feel that's the greatest tool
that's the heaviest isn't it it's one of
them yeah I will the bloody min
ash-shaitani rajeem to seek refuge from
the Shaitaan refuge you know with Allah
from the Shaitaan and then just just to
remember what you're standing upon yeah
and that's the Shahada and that that has
always been sufficient for me but does
our Eman wax and wane of course being
around righteous people does help you
people when you're down that helped
encourage you and lift your spirits back
oh yeah yeah I mean as much as you can
hang around people who are not only
righteous but who want good for you
mm-hmm because there are a lot of people
who who don't necessarily want good for
you maybe they're jealous of you maybe
they feel threatened by you yeah who
knows but what would really help me and
we're almost out of time is the prayer
the connection with the creator many
Muslims they slack on this and really
establishing and getting grounded with
that connection minimum five times a day
yeah absolutely has this really helped
you and another thing is increasing the
prayers because there's a saying that if
you leave the sooner you will leave the
fart uh-huh you know if all you do is
you pray the minimum number of prayers
and you don't ever pray any extra
prayers if you're only praying the
minimum number of prayers you don't have
anything to slack off on yeah and if
you're a man gets hit for a blow and you
just kind of feel like not doing as much
as you used to do that's when you'd
least lose the fart per
but if you are in the practice of making
your sunnah prayers your extra non
obligatory prayers and something comes
along to just kind of lower your sense
of belief or lower your your zeal for
the practice of the religion you can
leave the sunnah prayers without
compromising the obligatory prayers and
you will keep your religion intact yes
so it's nice to sort of buffer yourself
and sort of make a safety zone yeah by
doing by practicing on a normal basis
more than what you have to it's like
extra cardio here yeah there you go
yeah okay so for our not yet Muslim
brothers in humanity who are watching
maybe for the first time and many of
them I get many emails and they like
what we have to say the message is
simple worship the One God alone and not
his creation do the good that he wants
you to do because that's a manifestation
of your belief talk is cheap do
righteous actions develop yourself to be
the best human being that you can be
they are sincerely a lot of them you
know they're attentive ly listening what
advice do you have for them because
you've been there and you've done that
and then also how people can get a hold
of you if they need to read some of your
books and maybe have a nice dialogue
with you you know I was just talking
with a man the other day who was asking
me how can I know for sure you know
basically you know he had been raised
upon Catholicism he liked everything I
was saying but he didn't trust himself
to make the decision and I said don't
don't make the decision go back to your
Creator pray to your Creator and leave
the decision with him okay you've got
your job you have to study you have to
investigate you have to to the best of
your ability find out what what the
truth is but in the end there's nothing
that replaces the power of the creator
so pray to God ask him to put the truth
into your heart and into your mind to
show you the direction to make you
sincere and truthful and to put you upon
the right path and then when you feel it
certainty enter your heart when you feel
the certainty enter your mind that is
when you follow the direction you feel
where our Creator has given you thank
you very much may God Almighty Allah
reward you for being with us and and and
get in contact with dr. Brown some of
his books to look him up he's at level
truth calm if you want to contact him
press the contact button and you'll have
access to him and thank you again for
tuning in to the Dean show we're here to
help you understand what it's all about
purpose of life why are you here why
you've been created all these very
important topics because at the end of
the day the party will end we will all
die and we're going to be accountable
for everything we did in this life so we
better get with it now before it's too
late so hope you like hope you like what
we have to say if you'd like a free copy
of the verbatim Word of God if you have
some more questions call the number on
the screen 1 800 662 Islam until next
time peace be unto you